I humbly ask, are we witnessing the collapse of our nation?

[JawZ]

After watching President Obama's first press conference the other night which I felt was very awkward, and now watching the NYSE take a plunge on the "good news" of the stimulus....I wonder if this is the beginning of the end. When the NYSE went up on the news of new job losses the other day....it's embracing natural course correction which builds confidence. When we inject unnatural economic tools into that natural equation, the Exchange reacts with less confidence and thus...less investment.


I hope with every fibre of my being, that I am dead wrong.


How does everyone feel about all of this?

[YARDofSTUF]

Nah, we have a few more years still.

[downhill]

I don't think the nation will collapse. We've been through some pretty hard times. What's unusual is how the economic collapse is affecting the whole world.

With free trade as huge as it is or at least a lot less protectionism as it used to be, it's really a huge world economy with umm..something akin to local economies within it.

I do hear a ton about the economic stimulus package...and what's being talked about is less than 2 percent of America's GDP. At least for last year.

I think we'll weather it but I also think that it's going to get worse before it turns around.

[Dan]

I don't think the nation will collapse. We've been through some pretty hard times. What's unusual is how the economic collapse is affecting the whole world.

.

I agree

[Brent]

We've been through harder times as a nation, so I don't think this is the end, its just been a while things have been so dire so everyone is in a panic.

IMO, Obama's speech was really good last night, I watched the entire thing, I liked it. What I got from it is that he wants this bill to be pushed through fast because we need something NOW. Congress is just taking too long getting something to him, they are fighting amongst each other, politics, instead of getting something out quickly. They are pretty slow on action, and all Obama wants is some action NOW because we need it NOW and the American people are demanding action NOW. Some even think we should just do nothing, which certainly won't help. I want action NOW.

[blebs]

Inside my soul, I feel the answer is yes.

[mountainman]

I say "no" as there's a reason we have a vote every four years. If times are still suckin', boot him out.

(OK OK -- It didn't work for W, but that's another thread.)

[Roody]

nah we will rebound. It may be a couple years though.

[Brent]

nah we will rebound. It may be a couple years though.

That's the problem I see, it isn't going to happen soon. The President wants it to happen now though, he wants action from Congress now, but like usual they aren't too quick to respond. I hope he can inject a sense of urgency in them. This is what the people demand and expect anyway, we want action now.

[JawZ]

That's the problem I see, it isn't going to happen soon. The President wants it to happen now though, he wants action from Congress now, but like usual they aren't too quick to respond. I hope he can inject a sense of urgency in them. This is what the people demand and expect anyway, we want action now.

Brent, not all of us want the action that is being proposed. I don't understand how spending almost a trillion dollars is supposed to help cure a bankruptcy. Our national debt is 10 trillion. We spend 3.4 billion a day.

[RoscoPColtrane]

I say "no" as there's a reason we have a vote every four years. If times are still suckin', boot him out.

(OK OK -- It didn't work for W, but that's another thread.)

This problem is more than just the Pres. Hell we haven't even given him a chance yet, hes been in office for like ten minutes. My oh my how fast the media and everyone has turned on the 'savior'.

The problem is with these lifelong career senators who are in it for themselves. We need term limits on these fools. They need to remember they are put in office as public servants not to make money. If they don't do what the people of their state want then its the peoples responsibility to ensure they are not re-elected. People love to point fingers yet continue to vote in the same idiots every election.

[YARDofSTUF]

My oh my how fast the media and everyone has turned on the 'savior'.

Equal to the speed at which he was given the title though. lol

[Paft]

We're not, but we will be if we keep doing bailout after bailout after bailout.

We're commiting the cardinal sin of money: We are spending more than we are making. As a nation. From the individual consumer declaring bankruptcy because they lived beyond their means, to the individual cities each going over-budget every year, to the states that can't meet their budgets, to the federal government - no agency is willing to bite the bullet and say, "That's enough. We have no more money to spend. We cannot afford to keep going like this, and we need to cut back." THAT is what needs to happen, and it needs to happen now.

You know what the bailouts are doing? They're saying, "Oh, it's ok to screw up and not plan and spend more than you have - big daddy government will come in and up your allowance to make sure you can cover everything." That's not healthy, that's not sane, and that's not good. This country needs to go back to the point where businesses were by and large allowed to fail (excepting things like the FDIC, which serve to increase confidence in banks, which helps the economy) and other businesses were able to step in with better products and processes and take their place. Times like that spawned innovation - times like we have now only spawn stagnation.

If we'd just tighten our belts, learn to live within our means, and cut out the fat... we'd be fine.

[RoscoPColtrane]

Equal to the speed at which he was given the title though. lol

LOL, pretty danged close!

For what its worth, I hope he manages to do well. We need it...

[Brent]

Ya know, it isn't all within the Presidents power to fix things. A ton of other people in government also have to work at it.

[JawZ]

Ya know, it isn't all within the Presidents power to fix things. A ton of other people in government also have to work at it.

Private industry, the financial industry, banking...all of these pillars of capitalism need to do their part first. Our apathy has allowed capitalism to become some sort of government function which it is not.

If you watch the news closely, you'll see that the market is trying to make the necessary course corrections which would bring us out of recession the right way...but because we have allowed business to dictate government policy, we now are in a position where we are compelled to act.

Well, if government is now a business...then we are it's shareholders. And like any other business....I demand that we reach profitability!

If we're speaking of government, stop spending. If we're a business, make us profitable.

[blebs]

The problem is with these lifelong career senators who are in it for themselves. We need term limits on these fools. They need to remember they are put in office as public servants not to make money. If they don't do what the people of their state want then its the peoples responsibility to ensure they are not re-elected. People love to point fingers yet continue to vote in the same idiots every election.

This pretty much nails it right here. I'd like to know why the average american voter is too stupid to cut the dead weights and put someone else in those positions. I try every election. I've tried so much, in vane, that I really don't feel my vote counts in these elections.

[YeOldeStonecat]

I voted "No". We are resilient. We've bounced back before, we'll bounce back again, and we'll keep in bouncing back if we have to.

[knightmare]

There will be more collapse until the Govt. has it's needed control. When this entity we call our Govt. feels it controls most all areas of the economy, then we will see a slight rebound.

The markets will have to be slightly stable at least to enter the New World Economy.

[knightmare]

nah we will rebound. It may be a couple years though.

Do most have a couple of years? People who are laid off/small towns with no hope of recovery? 2 more years of this with unemployment getting near 10% in some places--(actual figures are higher, but the way unemployment is calculated keeps the numbers down)

[Gixxer]

we are probably at the beginning of this BS and look how FAST it has gotten out of control. not sure what all it will bring, but it's gonna be one hell of a ride.

[horsemen_]

i say do like Russia did back in the late 80 and the country as a whole goes bankrupt. look at Russia now they have a ton of cash and on the way back to being a super power as we try to say we are a superpower but we really we are not. i

[Gixxer]

i say do like Russia did back in the late 80 and the country as a whole goes bankrupt. look at Russia now they have a ton of cash and on the way back to being a super power as we try to say we are a superpower but we really we are not. i

russia = no cash

usa = only superpower

[MadDoctor]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_fi ... _2008-2009

[David]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_fi ... _2008-2009

Russia become dependent of its raw material exports. They are paying a price for the Kremlin's usurping major business investments out of foreign hands.

[David]

After watching President Obama's first press conference the other night which I felt was very awkward, and now watching the NYSE take a plunge on the "good news" of the stimulus....I wonder if this is the beginning of the end. When the NYSE went up on the news of new job losses the other day....it's embracing natural course correction which builds confidence. When we inject unnatural economic tools into that natural equation, the Exchange reacts with less confidence and thus...less investment.


I hope with every fibre of my being, that I am dead wrong.


How does everyone feel about all of this?

The NYSE should not be viewed as the ultimate meter for the US economy. It is premature to call the coroner, though I doubt the US will ever have the same stature.

BTW... did you watch the 60 minutes segment re: investment condos in the Miami area?