We all want privacy. Read this I just typed it.

JustWantPrivacy · Post by **JustWantPrivacy** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 12:58 am

EDIT: I'm done typing, I didnt re read this thing. Just wanted to speak my mind straight up.

Hey guys just joined and I'm looking to become an active user. Looks like a lot of you know what you're talking about, I'm sure some of you are ex-hackers or still do a little hacking. (hopefully ethical)

I wanted to jump right in and start a discussion about real stuff that's going on right now in the world of computing and security. Security for Windows is garbage for the most part. I'm not some super networking guru or a master of securing networks, I'm a power user and I dabble in pretty much everything.

Windows XP and Windows Vista

These are the operating systems that the main stream public and most people are using, I want to start talking about Windows XP I really think a good hacker can own any Windows XP box antivirus software, firewall software, disabling services, disabling netbios, disabling client for windows xp and file sharing can only go so far. Even if you have a standard firewall that's built into your internet gateway whats to say they can't control it by modifying the firmware or making changes to the firewall rules.

I'M NOT CRAZY
I had a fresh Windows XP install locked down to the max thanks to a good head and http://www.markusjansson.net/exp.html | http://tweakhound.com/xp/security/page_1.htm

With this new Windows install I noticed while I'm online surfing the net I'm always sending out packets. When I would watch a YouTube video I would send out packets, when I would visit websites I would send out packets. Now I know some of this is normal but what is no normal is the ratio of sent/received packets if I received 100k packets I would send out more then 80k if I received 400k packets I would send out more then 350k packets. This is very weird, kind of makes me think that what ever I'm doing is somehow being sent back to someone. Keep in mind I had Avast running along with Sygate firewall. Everything was locked down, I only allowed things that I know are system files but even on that topic you never know what is really what. Some things are digitally signed and some aren't and WHY THE %^$# do I have to confirm access to Windows applications/dlls/services whatevers. WHAT KIND OF SECURITY IS THAT. Why do I have to confirm things that the OS does normally like svchost stuff and the spooler, host process and etc. This is retarded, ALL firewall software should be required to know what the hell is what. But I guess that's too much to ask for. You have to freak out because Zone Alarm is telling you that rundll32 is trying to do something but it all comes back to be "Windows components" Zone Alarms recommendation is to block it but then if you block it the Internet doesnt work right. It's all too much man, it should be this hard to know if you're really secure or not. Who the hell knows if you have a rootkit or what have you. You can do tons and tons of scans and the system could always show clean but really you're infected and the hacker could be monitoring what they want to monitor.

Comodo Firewall is garbage, it's anti virus is garbage there is an expolit out for it right now on milw0rm and **** thats the popular super secret exploit site. Real hackers don't pluck around with this stuff they code their own adn discover things on there own, they network with other hackers and live and breath this stuff it's like a drug to them. But it really freaks me out that you can have your entire life online and someone could be watching you the whole time and you dont even know it OR worst you know it and try to do everything you can do about it but can't do jack. I just bought a new HP m8300f from CCity they've got it on sale right now so I said why the hell not. Usually I would build it on my own but stuff is kinda of crazy right now and I really dont have the time do that. I priced it all out and it turned out to be a good value other then me having to remove all the spyware that comes with it from the factory. THIS IS MY FIRST EVER DESKTOP PURCHASE. Yes it really is, other then a few laptops I had.

This thing came with Vista and Vista is supposed to be the super secure operating system, I read some articles that said it was the least vulnerable OS upon release within the first year or something like that. They made it sound all secure and everything thing else. But really after a few days of using it, (used it before but never really plucked around like I did now, heard it was not worth it OH THATS RIGHT) Anyways sorry been using it for a few days now and I can see its nothing more then XP with fancy graphics and other BS. You would think they would integrate all this stuff somehow without having to worry about dlls and all this other stuff that you have no idea about. Worms and other things disguise them selves as real Windows files all the time and you know it.

I'm done typing sorry I can't do this anymore, just wanted to let some of this steam out.

PLEASE post some information on what you do to keep secure, don't post ohh I used Norton and SpySweeper because that just doesn't cut it anymore and if you think it does then I hope you're just a normal Internet user that signs in checks your email (spam) and uploads some pics to your FaceBook. If you're that person then there is nothing wrong with that, nobody wants to see what you're doing online at least not most people. But for those of us who spend alot of time and alot of out life online privacy is key and there are actually people out there that would sit there and monitor every single thing that you do and basically shadow your life as you're living it. REALLY scary if you think about it.

SO, if you read this whole thing great hopefully you feel my pain, if not no big. But if you feel for me please share your knowledge and expertise, whats the best way to have a close to fool proof setup and what do you know that WORKS. I'm sure that some people setup their systems and then purposely try to have them hacked, exploited or something in some way.

2+++ heads are better then one.

SHARE YOUR KNOWLEDGE, SHARE YOUR LINKS, feel free to post or PM. Thanks for letting me vent.

YARDofSTUF · Post by **YARDofSTUF** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 1:11 am

Comodo Firewall isnt garbage.

Look into a home firewall box, like run endian firewall or untangle, very handy.

You seem like you're stressing over nothing.

JustWantPrivacy · Post by **JustWantPrivacy** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 2:04 am

Why? When a good hacker can just setup a site that looks exactly like theirs or even easier just force the download of their own version. Basically you're download their edited version and etc. You ever wonder why every security app in XP shows up as PROGRA~FILES1 or some **** instead of the normal path like the rest of the apps. ?? Weird why does that happen.?

YARDofSTUF · Post by **YARDofSTUF** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 3:00 am

JustWantPrivacy wrote:Why? When a good hacker can just setup a site that looks exactly like theirs or even easier just force the download of their own version. Basically you're download their edited version and etc. You ever wonder why every security app in XP shows up as PROGRA~FILES1 or some **** instead of the normal path like the rest of the apps. ?? Weird why does that happen.?

The simple answer, you're paranoid. If this is such a big issue for you buy a Mac.

JustWantPrivacy · Post by **JustWantPrivacy** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 3:16 am

Yes they are secure, but you make it sound like their unhackable. If someone knew you were on a Mac wouldn't they just go out and find all the mac exploits?

mnosteele52 · Post by **mnosteele52** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 8:57 am

HIPS - Host Intrusion Protection System, it protects you from any change to your pc without your knowledge or consent. Many programs have this feature now, Kaspersky Anti-Virus & Prevx have it, Windows Defender & Comodo Firewall have it for free. I would agree that you are being a bit paranoid, what I don't think you understand it what all those packets are that are sending from your pc. Most of them are the "phone home" part of Windows, MS does some of it to improve Windows, I don't completely agree with it but I understand their reasoning. It's not as easy as you think for a hacker to access your pc. If you have an excellent antivirus program and firewall along with a router and you setup Windows properly then it is extremely unlikely you will be compromised.

Post by **YeOldeStonecat** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 9:32 am

Yah...nothing to bite your fingernails over or loose lots of sleep over.

Get behind a router with NAT
Never leave your Administrator account password <blank>
Maintain your Windows Updates
Use a good antivirus software like Eset NOD32 or Kaspersky
Use an alternative browser if you surf questionable sites...even regular sites....use Firefox or Opera

If you want a software firewall..to monitor outbound connections...yes..welcome to the nagginess of them, they'll just up and you with alerts all the time. You'll always have quite a bit of outbound traffic...even if your PC is sitting still without you doing anything. Not only is Windows keeping in touch with Microsoft for stuff like checking for updates, but other software you install also...Java, Adobe Acrobloat, Macromedia, your antivirus software checking for updates, some anti-ad/spyware software checking for updates....lots and lots of software, by default during installation because many people to pay careful attention to what they install or what options you have during install, they'll install to auto start with Windows and frequently automatically check for updates.

Sit back and enjoy the computer...that's what it's there for. Follow some basic precaution steps, don't get consumed with fear. If you frequent a few tech security forums...some members there crack me up sometimes. It's like...they'll go online with their computer for 15 minutes...and then they'll spend the next 23 hours of the day biting their nails and ripping out their hair in fear...cleaning out the PC and running a hundred different scans worrying they picked up something.

SeedOfChaos · Post by **SeedOfChaos** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 1:38 pm

Basically, I see it like this... if a real hacker wants to hack you, he will, regardless of what OS you run. (Normal) People who think they can surf the web anonymously are dreaming. If someone really wants to watch you online, they will.

The question is... why would they? Is there any sensitive data on your PC? That's what hackers are usually after. For myself, I can safely assume that I'm uninteresting. I don't keep any meaningful (private) data on my PC, nor do I do a lot of online shopping and the like.

The only way to be 100% safe is not to use the PC, or at least not connect it to the web. End of story.

cchooper · Post by **cchooper** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 2:02 pm

JustWantPrivacy wrote:With this new Windows install I noticed while I'm online surfing the net I'm always sending out packets. When I would watch a YouTube video I would send out packets, when I would visit websites I would send out packets. Now I know some of this is normal but what is no normal is the ratio of sent/received packets if I received 100k packets I would send out more then 80k if I received 400k packets I would send out more then 350k packets. This is very weird, kind of makes me think that what ever I'm doing is somehow being sent back to someone.

Hello, and welcome to the forums. I highly recommend you read about TCP and how it ensures packets are delivered (I'll give you a hint, your computer will send packets back to the source with the ACK bit set). If you are truly concerned about what packets are being sent back to YouTube or Microsoft or whoever you are scared of, then I would recommend downloading a sniffer (such as Wireshark) and running it while you do your thing and browse the Internet. When you're done, take a look at the packets it's captured and see if any of is "strange."

There is a very thin line between paranoia and being secure.

P.S. - TLDR

P.P.S. - If they want to watch you, they don't need to backdoor your Windows install and make it "phone home"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Room_641A
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ECHELON
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carnivore_%28FBI%29
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Onyx_%28in ... _system%29

CableDude · Post by **CableDude** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 6:35 pm

YeOldeStonecat wrote:Adobe Acrobloat,

catahoula · Post by **catahoula** » Wed Mar 05, 2008 9:42 pm

I understand how you feel. We spend alot of money buying a computer, router, internet service, and then, spen alot of time trying to keep it all secure.

There is great info here. Just take it one step at a time.