OMG! I officially hate Abercrombie and Fitch!!!

XSeaNX · Post by **XSeaNX** » Fri Apr 19, 2002 10:41 pm

LOL!!! w00t SG polish unite!!

lol reminds me of a friend of mine whos polish....he took a LARGE polish flag....wrapped it around him..and ran around like a friggin nut at one of our pep rallys...it was the funniest thing I had seen that year...ofcourse hes always baggin me up....OMG...those were the days

poptom · Post by **poptom** » Fri Apr 19, 2002 10:49 pm

Sheesh! Where's the raciscm? It seems some people are reading a message that really isn't there. There are Chinese laundries around and they can do a darn good job of making shirts and sheets white.

I think it's a pretty clever slogan and it's been around a long time.

Joint Chiefs of Staff · Fri Apr 19, 2002 10:49 pm

Originally posted by Qwijib0

w00t! go polish people!!

me = teh 1/2 too

LOL me too, well sorta off. Russian, Irish and little Pole.

soooooo

How do you get a one armed pollock out of a tree?

Wave to him.

Jim · Post by **Jim** » Fri Apr 19, 2002 11:03 pm

First off, XSeanX, about the racism towards whites, that's why I pasted that column a few pages ago.

On to the post.

Originally posted by poptom
Sheesh! Where's the raciscm? It seems some people are reading a message that really isn't there. There are Chinese laundries around and they can do a darn good job of making shirts and sheets white.

I think it's a pretty clever slogan and it's been around a long time.

Note: If (for some reason) people find the bottom pic more offensive, let me know, and I'll remove it. This is only to illustrate a point, even if it is just my point of view.

*cough* Anyway, so you're saying its not racist. So then would you agree that AF should (not COULD, but SHOULD) put the the other images below?

If they should print this:

Why shouldn't they print these?

Seriously, if the top one is so far from being racist in any sort of way, what's wrong with that bottom one? How is that not racist? [Sarcasm]Think of the witty captions that you could put with that on a shirt! The teens would buy it like mad![/Sarcasm]
Would you approve if someone like a child of yours wore a shirt like the one on top, but not approve if it were one of the bottom two?

[/Rant]

Paft · Post by **Paft** » Fri Apr 19, 2002 11:07 pm

Not to be a total prick or anything, but if a parent wants to let their kid wear **** like that, then by all means. I hate racism.. will state again for the reading impared.. I hate racism, but I would care less if someone had a white slur, or indian slur, or whatever on their clothes. That's how you feel? Good! More power to you.. aren't causing me any physical harm.

Brent · Post by **Brent** » Fri Apr 19, 2002 11:21 pm

perhaps we are confusing racism with stereotyping

those pics are more stereotyping then they are down right racism

maybe in real poor taste, but i don't think they are racism

but what do i know, i'm just a dumb white boy

BMED · Post by **BMED** » Fri Apr 19, 2002 11:23 pm

Even though it isn't justification...I've been putting up with Irish jokes and stereotypes for many, many years. I also have American Indian (tribe? Have to ask my Aunt) mixed in with my heritage...now that's a truly argumentive debate of "Ethnic Cleansing".

No two people are the same, we are like snow flakes. Get over your racial tensions and start living life as an individual...look inside yourself for your true identity (you may be surprised!).

Year 2525, Did you hear the one about the DNA #1511717517....and the DNA #5858124655, they were about to..........

GET IT!

Joint Chiefs of Staff · Sat Apr 20, 2002 12:01 am

Originally posted by BMED
Year 2525, Did you hear the one about the DNA #1511717517....and the DNA #5858124655, they were about to..........

Very well put BMED.

CiscoKid · Post by **CiscoKid** » Sat Apr 20, 2002 1:23 am

Originally posted by Qwijib0
Oh, no! somebody made a pun!

you seen the communith college team mascot on an indian reservation in colo. " the fighting whities " I'm white. I find that funny.

If somebody had a shirt that said "Smith brothers laundry service...etc" I wouldn't take offense. I;d go "good job ye pun maker"

P.C. == Teh B.S.

That's technically legal though...since you is teh unwanted guest

I'll look for the joke I found about a year ago...US bought by Indian representitives from two drunks in SF. Purchase price: several cases of wine, and a couple of bottles os Wiskey and a few bottles of Rum

jennyshooker · Post by **jennyshooker** » Sat Apr 20, 2002 1:40 am

Anthropophobia: looks like we have a few of these ppl here..
You know who you are.
lol

jennyshooker · Post by **jennyshooker** » Sat Apr 20, 2002 1:46 am

this thread blew up quick huh!!!

CiscoKid · Post by **CiscoKid** » Sat Apr 20, 2002 1:48 am

Hey, people with a real sence of humor can laugh at their own people...make jokes about them and NOT get offended when others do the same...

here's a few from Dougles Spotted Eagle...

COLD WINTER!
The Blackfeet asked their Chief in autumn, if the winter was going to be cold or not. Not really knowing the answer, the chief replies that the winter was going to be cold and that the members of the village were to collect wood to be prepared.
Being a good leader, he then went to the nearest phone booth and called the National Weather Service and asked, "Is this winter to be cold?" The man on the phone responded, "This winter was going to be quite cold indeed."
So the Chief went back to speed up his people to collect even more wood to be prepared. A week later he called the National Weather Service again, "Is it going to be a very cold winter?"
"Yes," the man replied, "its going to be a very cold winter."
So the Chief goes back to his people and orders them to go and find
every scrap of wood they can find. Two weeks later he calls the National Weather Service again and asks "Are you absolutely sure, that the winter is going to be very cold?"
"Absolutely" the man replies, "the Blackfeet are collecting wood like crazy!"

THE BRONZE RAT
A Cheyenne guy went to Chinatown in San Francisco. While there he found a bronze rat at a thrift store. "How much do you want for the rat" he asked. "$3 for the rat and $1000 for the story that goes with it" said the shopkeeper. "Just give me the rat," the Cheyenne said, and then he left with it. As he walked down the street he noticed a couple of rats following him. As he walked further, more and more rats started chasing him. By the time he got to the bay, there were thousands of rats chasing him. So he climbed up a pole and threw the bronze rat into the water. To his amazement, all the rats jumped into the water.
The Cheyenne then returned to the thrift store. "Ahh" the china man said. "Now you would like to hear the story?"
"No" said the Cheyenne, "I just came back to see if you had any bronze white men!"
MONTANA DEPARTMENT OF FISH AND GAME ADVISORY ON BEARS

Helena Montana, January 31, 1999 - In light of the rising frequency of human/grizzly bear conflicts, the Montana Department of Fish and Game is advising hikers, hunters, and fishermen to take extra precautions and keep alert for bears while in the field. "We advise that outdoorsmen should wear noisy little bells on their clothing so as not to startle bears that aren't expecting them," a spokesman said. "We also advise outdoorsmen to carry pepper spray with them in case of an encounter with a bear".
It is also a good idea to watch out for fresh signs of bear activity. Outdoorsmen should recognize the difference between black bear and grizzly bear paw prints and scat.
A grizzly's paw is larger and its claws are longer than that of a black bear. Black bear scat contains lots of berries and squirrel fur. Grizzly bear scat has little bells in it and smells like pepper.

Anglos have BC and AD to measure time. Native People only have the four BC's****(see bottom of page)

This wagon train is heading across the desert, when all of a sudden the wagon master notices that on all sides of the valley, there are Indian guys. He quickly forms the wagons into the "Hollywood" circle, to protect the families in the train. Nothing happens. Soon, drums are heard pounding out in the distance, BUM, bum, bum, bum, BUM, bum, bum, bum, BUM, bum, bum, bum.......(the famous Hollywood drumbeat from the John Ford movies) The wagon master tells the train, "I don't like the sound of this...." From out in the distance comes another voice, saying, "We don't like the sound of it either. He's not our regular drummer!"

2 Lakota guys and a dude from New York are on a hunting trip. On the first day, one Lakota goes out, and less than an hour later returns with a deer. The guy from New York is blown away. "How did you get your deer so fast?!" "Easy" says the Lakota guy, "I looked for tracks, found them, followed them, and got my deer."
The next day the 2nd Lakota guy goes out, and less than an hour later returns with a deer. The guy from New York is blown away again, just flabbergasted. "How did you get YOUR deer so fast?!" "It's simple" says the Lakota guy, "I looked for tracks, found them, followed them, and there was the deer."
On the third day, the New York guy goes out. He doesn't return, and when darkness begins to fall, the two Lakota guys go looking for him. They found him lying at the base of a hill, bloodied up, clothes torn, and bones broken. "What happened to you?" they asked. "I did just what you told me to do, I looked for tracks, found them, followed them, and the damn train ran me over."

A Cheyenne man goes into a grocery store, and asks for a package of toilet paper. The clerk offers him 3 kinds, Charmin, Best Brand, and Generic. The Cheyenne man takes the generic. He comes back in a week later, throws the remainder of the toilet paper at the store clerk and says, "I don't want no cheap John Wayne toilet paper!" The clerk laughs and says, "It's not John Wayne toilet paper, it's GENERIC toilet paper." The Cheyenne guy tells him, 'You can call it whatever you want, but it's rough, tough, and won't take crap off nobody!"

A Dine' guy is sitting in a bus stop with two old Anglo men. The first Anglo guy says, "Hey Herb, where you going for vacation this year?" Herb tells him, "I'm going to Montana to fish this year", The first guy looks at him and exclaims, "What you want to go there fer? They ain't nothin but a bunch of damned Indians up there." Herb then says, "Well, where you goin?" The first guy says, "I'm going to Arizona and soak up some sun!" Herb looks at him and yells, "You moron, there's nothing but a bunch of Indians in Arizona!" Then the little Dine' guy speaks up and comments, "Why don't you both just go to hell! There's no Indians there."

Between the reservation and the city, there is a road that marks the boundary lines. On one side of the road are the res dogs, and they just kind of lie around staying cool. On the city side are the city dogs, and they always chase cars as they go down the road, barking, "Bow-wow, Bow-wow". One day the city dogs ask the res dogs, "How come you never chase cars with us?" The res dogs respond, "What's the point, it's just a waste of time. The cars don't do anything when you chase them." The city dogs tell the res dogs that they think its just a lot of fun, so finally the res dogs agree to try it just once.
The next car comes down the road, and the dogs from both sides chase the car. The city dogs bark, "Bow-wow, Bow-wow" and the res dogs chase too, but they bark, "Bow-wow, Bow-wow, Bow-wow, Bow-wow eeeehhhhhhhhhhh." :-)

What did the Dine' lady say first time she went into Pizza Hut?
"Who threw up on my fry bread?"
NASA asked this elder Dine' guy to record a message to put on their newest S.E.T.I. satellite, along with messages from other cultures and languages. He records the message, the satellite is launched, and one day CNN broadcasts the messages being sent into outer space from the spacecraft. A huge belly laugh is heard coming from the entire northern portion of Arizona. When CNN asks why the people are laughing, a man from Chinle tells them, "The message says that if they are hearing this, to stay quiet and don't respond, because as soon as the white man knows where those aliens live, they'll come over for dinner, and end up NEVER going home!"

An Apache guy, who had spent his whole life in the desert, goes to visit a friend who had moved to town. He'd never seen a train or the tracks they run on.
While standing in the middle of the railroad tracks one day, he hears this whistle -- Whooee da Whoee! -- but doesn't know what it is.
BAM!!, he's hit by the train and tossed to the side of the tracks. It was only a glancing blow, so he was lucky enough to live through it with a few broken bones and some bruises.

After weeks in the hospital recovering, he's at his friend's house attending a party one evening. While in the kitchen, he suddenly hears the teapot whistling. He grabs a baseball bat from the nearby closet and proceeds to batter and bash the teapot into an unrecognizable lump of metal. His friend, hearing the noise, rushes into the kitchen, sees what's happened and asks the Apache guy, "Why'd you bust up my teapot?" The desert man replies, "Shii' kiis', you gotta kill these things when they're small."

Two Indians at Plymouth Rock watch a huge ship full of white people pulling into the harbor. The one looks at the other and asked "Do you think they'll stay overnight?".

Did you know that vegetarian is an indigenous word? Translated it mean "Can't hunt"!

What do Eskimos get from sitting on the ice too long?
Polaroids.

What do Eskimos get from rubbing noses too many times?
Sniffilis.

What do you call a boomerang that doesn't work?
A stick.

Remember, one cannot make footprints in the sands of time by sitting on their butt, and who wants to leave butt prints in the sands of time?

***
Before Columbus
Before Custer
Before Commodity....
Before Costner!!

samMEs2b · Post by **samMEs2b** » Sat Apr 20, 2002 2:10 am

Originally posted by BIGJIMSLATE

Well hold on, you have a problem with people protesting something they don't like? What else do you expect someone to do if they're offended (whether you agree with them or not) by something like this?

And yeah, like I had said in an earlier thread, whites are probably the biggest group who people can make racial jokes or puns about and get away with. There's no problem calling someone "whitey" (ie, Brent's post), but if Brent were to call him a nig*er, all hell would break loose.

Again, I'm not saying I agree with most PC bull (since most of it IS bull), but some things do cross a line, and I believe this is one of them (even if I am whiter than Conan O'Brien).

I couldn't agree with u more, well put! Perfect example is african americans can use their own slang(if you will) and call each other nigga but nig*er is completly degrading and disrespectful... I dont get it????

but to each their own, you dont like the shirt or whatever it may be, DONT BUY IT! ON WITH LIFE, there isnt much you can do, so dont dwell on it

terrancelam · Post by **terrancelam** » Sat Apr 20, 2002 2:11 am

to XseanX, F U!! Do you know why people of ethic minority make fun of people of caucasian decent? Do you? Granted the majority of people (like 90%) of caucasians don't deserve that kind of treatment, given the past history of what "caucasians" have done to people of visable ethic minorities, it's given they will harbor some hostile resentment towards the "white man". The "white man" forced African natives into slavery and killed and raped whole tribes, why? Because they could. The "white man" lured people from china to Canda to work on the rail roads so that trains could travel from east to west. What did they get for it? A cheap burial under the railroad tracks. Given the track record, it's not even laughable. And saying that your proud that a company should have the right to stereo type all people with "slanty eyes" as being laundry cleaners is a fricken disgrace to liberal democracy and also the achievements of freedom in this century. Sure some asian people operate "Dry Cleaner" operations, but do you know why they do it historically? Because NO OTHER JOBS WERE OFFERED TO THEM IN THE PAST IN AMERICA OR CANADA. God bless racism at it's best. As well as ignorance.

Saying that do a good job? Saying they do a good job IS A FRICKEN SLAP IN THE FACE! Would you like it if I said "Hey there WHITE INDIVIDUAL MALE! You are doing a good job at being dumb as **** and still getting the job over a person of visable minority!" Do you think that would make a good shirt, because that is EXACTLY what the AF shirt is.

And it's not that people are complaining about just a t-shirt. It's the whole generalization and stereo typing of a minority which is plain retarded! What kind of a civilized nation lets something like that happen?

As for people cutting infront of you and saying racist crap like that, stand up for yourself. Don't like incidents with stupid retarded individuals without a sense of society get in the way of your life. Just be smart about it and raise awareness of the situation. These people are protesting to try and raise awareness of the situation. Just because people of my ethinicity in the past suffered because of your, doesn't give me the right to step all over you. But it sure as hell doesn't give you the right to come and classify me and make generalizations about my ethinic minority. It's a little legal thing called slander.

WTF is PC? DO you even know? PC is something politicians are worried about, not high school kids. But do you know what respect is? Do you know what respect for your fellow citizen is? Jesus.

terrancelam · Post by **terrancelam** » Sat Apr 20, 2002 2:21 am

how can everyone just think so little of it? I don't know about the situation just because I'm asian, but because I learned about this in history class, both canadian and american history. What I'm wondering is why everyone is taking such a indifferent view to this other then jim....Jesus.. I need a break from this..This just makes me sick to my stomach.

JawZ · Post by **JawZ** » Sat Apr 20, 2002 2:51 am

Originally posted by terrancelam
how can everyone just think so little of it?

What I'm wondering is why everyone is taking such a indifferent view to this other then jim....Jesus.

I find it very very very easy Terrance. When you get a bit older, and live what you have been taught in those text books about life...you will come to find that you really don't have the time to worry about petty politically correct Bullsh!t like this.

I have better things to do with my time than to figure out how to oppress someone or practice racism against whatever group and blah blah blah......

Racism isn't even on my radar.

The only time I hear about it is on SG or the news or on TV.

I chose a long time ago to help wipe out racism by not practicing it ever. I am living by example. I suggest you do the same.

Don't allow yourself to become a victim. If a T-shirt is holding you down...then you have too much free time on your hands.

Nothing can bring me down.......if I were Asian...I'd go buy that ugly T-shirt and wear it to work lol...that would be the big F U to A&F haha!

BMED · Post by **BMED** » Sat Apr 20, 2002 2:55 am

Originally posted by terrancelam
how can everyone just think so little of it? I don't know about the situation just because I'm asian, but because I learned about this in history class, both canadian and american history. What I'm wondering is why everyone is taking such a indifferent view to this other then jim....Jesus.. I need a break from this..This just makes me sick to my stomach.

terrancelam,

You have taken the posts "out-of-context"...please read again!

Some peeps are ignorant to racism and sterotyping of ethnic groups...others play on it with humor! Don't allow your feelings about "past" history rule your "future". White, Black, Yellow or Green...we are still all human...we bleed the same color!

What AC&F did is wrong, but they will only prosper with our dollars...BOYCOTT the bastards! I already do!

If you can't beat'em....join'em and tear down thier Infrastructure!

JawZ · Post by **JawZ** » Sat Apr 20, 2002 2:59 am

I might add that the original thread starter of all this was influenced by the media's exposure of the decision of A&F to pull the T-shirts after protest.

http://www.iht.com/articles/55353.html

So it just goes to show you that the media just won't let racism die....racism sells!

Like I have always said...if it were not for teh news...racism would probably go by way of the dinosaur....it has for me. I don't practice it or will allow myself to become a victim of it.

Brent · Post by **Brent** » Sat Apr 20, 2002 3:02 am

as long as we keep seperating people into 'races' there will be 'racism'

i long for the day when we are just called 'humans'

in fact, that's what Star Trek is all about, seriously

a world in which race doesn't matter at all, we are just humans, one world among countless others....

The Original Star Trek pushed the envelope by having a black person, a russian, and an asian on the MAIN bridge all playing key roles, and then of course there was that racey and dangerous kiss between a black women (Uhura) and a white man (Kirk) on TV

until we stop seperating each other, we will remain seperate

BMED · Post by **BMED** » Sat Apr 20, 2002 3:07 am

Originally posted by Brent
as long as we keep seperating people into 'races' there will be 'racism'

i long for the day when we are just called 'humans'

in fact, that's what Star Trek is all about, seriously

a world in which race doesn't matter at all, we are just humans, one world among countless others....

The Original Star Trek pushed the envelope by having a black person, a russian, and an asian on the MAIN bridge all playing key roles, and then of course there was that racey and dangerous kiss between a black women (Uhura) and a white man (Kirk) on TV

until we stop seperating each other, we will remain seperate

Amen!

RoundEye · Post by **RoundEye** » Sat Apr 20, 2002 3:09 am

I agree with UOD, I have too many other real worries in life to concern myself with a t-shirt.

I guess the truth of the matter is, I don't care. I could give two shits about that shirt and who it bothers. If it offends you, that's your problem. I think too many people run around looking for something to gripe about, too much time on thier hands.

Do I look down on Asians or black people because of stereotypes? NO

I look down on people because of thier actions as an individual.

And in no way do I think I'm better than anybody else.

I just try to concern myself with what I think really matters in life, and I just don't concern myself with that shirt, because it has no bearing what-so-ever in my day to day affairs in life.

RoundEye · Post by **RoundEye** » Sat Apr 20, 2002 3:27 am

Another thing I just thought about..........

if you really wanted to stop the Asian stereotypes, why did you register under the name Hattori Hanzo, a 15th century Ninja, and use a anime character as your AV?

Hell, that gives me the impression that there is nothing but cartoon ninjas running around the Asian continent yelling "HI YA!"

Also does my name RoundEye offend you, since it's the opposite of SlantEye?

I guess it's all in how you want to look at things.

Damnit · Post by **Damnit** » Sat Apr 20, 2002 4:12 am

Originally posted by HattoriHanzo
Those stupid motherf****** b*****d. I want to kick their @$$. Why? Because they made some "racist" T-shirts. It was all about Asians like one shirt had two men with slanted eyes wearing triangular hats. The slogan: "Wong Brothers Laundry Service: Two Wongs can make it white." What the hell is that? Some of you guys might not care but I do. I'm Asian and I find that offensive.

Here's a link:
http://dailynews.yahoo.com/fc/US/Asian_Americans/

I Just read your post so dont hash me.......................................... but done be such a racist yourself...............Only raciest is one that makes a big deal about it their race is anyways anyways.................Dont think I get tired of the white boy jokes too?????????????????

torsten · Post by **torsten** » Sat Apr 20, 2002 4:34 am

I'm an individualist. I don't like negative stereotypes because they misrepresent many individuals within the group that's being categorized. So I can see how the shirt might irk someone. Still, it's not a big enough deal to start boycotts and protests over. I defend the right to do it, but I think it shows some skewed priorities.

Some have alluded to the real problem here -- the only thing that keeps racism (or the perception of it) alive -- DOUBLE STANDARDS. Until all groups are spoken of equally you're gonna have resentment and even some understandable hate. It's going to take some honesty and some blatant resistance to those double standards if we're ever gonna put an end to this racism thing. It's really very simple; If you can say something about me, I can say it about you. And I WILL. No exceptions. Don't like it? Tough.

Notre Dame Fighting Irish
North Dakota Fighting Sioux
Now guess which school's nickname is currently being denouced as horrible racist slander? Only ONE. Do any of you really have trouble guessing which one?

Treating people equally (and expecting it in return) can:
1: get you kicked out of school
2: fired from a job
3: make you a pariah (esp. on a univ. campus)
4: get you harmed physically

I know this because I've seen it and I've personally been called a "fascist," a "racist," a "hatemonger," etc. and lost many potential friends.
Why? Because I don't accept double standards. I've noticed that most people who think like I do either either keep their mouths shut out of fear, or just submit to the subtle brainwashing. PC may have originated out of a desire to spare feelings, but those days are long gone. If you want to find true racism (not gentle stereotyping, but the resentful, hateful kind), just listen for a while to your local PC brigade. Almost everything they spout is driven by an underlying loathing of European ancestry. If you haven't noticed this, just listen a little more closely.

It's actually kind of odd that this controversy involves Asians. Especially since it's getting publicity. The American media typically tries its hardest to ignore the existence of Asians in America. I mean can you honestly remember hearing anyone on ESPN complaining ad nauseum that there aren't enough Asian football coaches? Or that there aren't enough CEOs? Or members of Congress? Or that they can't get into elite colleges because of biased testing? Here's my theory: As a group, those of Asian ancestry have statistically done very well educationally and economically in the US compared to other minorities. And that, unfortunately, is the ultimate sin that the PC people will not forgive. It undermines many of their arguments. If you want to be one of PC America's sacred ethnicities, you had better not succeed.

Here's to real equality and the demise of PC.

Gandalf · Post by **Gandalf** » Sat Apr 20, 2002 10:27 am

It offends me.

Yes im Asian.

Deus ex Machina · Post by **Deus ex Machina** » Sat Apr 20, 2002 11:01 am

Walk a mile in another man's shoes.
It is too damned easy to dismiss another person's feelings when they mean nothing to you.
This is not science fiction or fantasy, it is the real world. Free speech does not allow you yell "fire" in a crowded theatre, or slander. We have limits.

Stereotype humour is best left to the ethnicity being ribbing and on the sly.

shant,
david <---- anudder polish guy....

Joint Chiefs of Staff · Sat Apr 20, 2002 11:08 am

Originally posted by Deus ex Machina
[B
shant,
david <---- anudder polish guy.... [/B]

So how does a Polish woman tighten her cloths line?

JawZ · Post by **JawZ** » Sat Apr 20, 2002 11:15 am

Originally posted by Deus ex Machina
Walk a mile in another man's shoes.
It is too damned easy to dismiss another person's feelings when they mean nothing to you.
This is not science fiction or fantasy, it is the real world. Free speech does not allow you yell "fire" in a crowded theatre, or slander. We have limits.

Stereotype humour is best left to the ethnicity being ribbing and on the sly.

shant,
david <---- anudder polish guy....

But is it not fantasy to pretend that you're the other guy...the victim? I can't pretend to feel what someone else feels or perceives to be real....I can only take care of me and do the right thing. that is all.....

p2ii · Post by **p2ii** » Sat Apr 20, 2002 11:22 am

torsten is right on the money! I feel the same way and no one should accept double standards.

]

Deus ex Machina · Post by **Deus ex Machina** » Sat Apr 20, 2002 11:24 am

Originally posted by UOD

But is it not fantasy to pretend that you're the other guy...the victim? I can't pretend to feel what someone else feels or perceives to be real....I can only take care of me and do the right thing. that is all.....

Utopia and empathy are not exactly synonymous. Is it not enough for someone to say, "Hey, I find that offensive."?

The yin-yang......
I am proud to be X.
I wish to be treated like everyone else.

There in lies the paradox.

shant,
david

mikemean · Post by **mikemean** » Sat Apr 20, 2002 11:46 am

I wouldn't boycott them just because of a silly shirt. That's all it is, a silly shirt. If I was that bothered by the shirt I just wouldn't buy it.

JawZ · Post by **JawZ** » Sat Apr 20, 2002 12:15 pm

Originally posted by Deus ex Machina

Is it not enough for someone to say, "Hey, I find that offensive."?

shant,
david

Sure it is...just don't get mad or offended when I say...I don't.

People need to understand that if they say something in earshot of someone else....they may get a response that is negative....

Action.....reaction.

Who controls thought? Is it you or do you allow the media to dictate your own thoughts?

If it were not for the media.....no one would be talking about this right now, hence racism would not be the debate of the day.......am I am personally sick and tired of debating the same OLD BS wether it be PC or not.

I've repeated this a hundred times.....we need to get past this and move on.

But as long as we all allow the media to dictate out thoughts, we will be forever caught in an endless loop of debate with no solution in sight.

Deus ex Machina · Post by **Deus ex Machina** » Sat Apr 20, 2002 12:31 pm

Originally posted by UOD

Sure it is...just don't get mad or offended when I say...I don't.

No one is mad at you, you did not create that t-shirt.

People need to understand that if they say something in earshot of someone else....they may get a response that is negative....

Action.....reaction.

No question..... If said commentary is a demeaning characture.... reaction....

Who controls thought? Is it you or do you allow the media to dictate your own thoughts?

You mean the Jews? (just kidding)
My thoughts are based on not only what I read, but what I experienced. It is clear that many folks have not faced derision as to appreciate the concept of "PC"

If it were not for the media.....no one would be talking about this right now, hence racism would not be the debate of the day.......am I am personally sick and tired of debating the same OLD BS wether it be PC or not.

The media gave the expression "common courtesy" a new name.

I've repeated this a hundred times.....we need to get past this and move on.

But as long as we all allow the media to dictate out thoughts, we will be forever caught in an endless loop of debate with no solution in sight. [/B]

Well.... The Washington football team is still called the "Redskins" Perhaps they should change it to the "Crackers" to honor the owners or the "Brownskins" to honor the majority of the players....

shant,
david

Randy · Post by **Randy** » Sat Apr 20, 2002 1:01 pm

when i read it i thought the white was how clean theluandry gets bcuz it can be difficult to get get whites white. ithought the play on words was we do it "RIGHT" but using the word WHITE instead. ..and then i thought.. ohh hey is pissed off bcuz he thinks they mean that they do it white=caucasion/white people style.

I can see how you would be mad of or jealus about how white people are so good at getting sh!t stains out of white undies

* listening to NOFX "dont call me white *

btw i love racist jokes as long as its noy hurting anyones feelings

Qwijib0 · Post by **Qwijib0** » Sat Apr 20, 2002 2:06 pm

Originally posted by Joint Chiefs Of Staff

So how does a Polish woman tighten her cloths line?

I have a feeling you'll be telling me

terrancelam · Post by **terrancelam** » Sat Apr 20, 2002 3:07 pm

it's not that I'm upset about the FRICKEN SHIRT! I'm upset about what the shirt represents. A PUT DOWN, from a transnational corporation none the less. Who give a **** about the shirt, I'll never wear on or buy anything from AF. What give them the right to come out and stereo type people when you are taught in school at a young age to not do so and RESPECT others as human beings?

Roundeye:
I'm not offended by your av or nick. Nor am I by HH. Why? Because he is an individual choosing to have a nick by that title. Does it offend me? No, because you aren't blatantly making it obviously that you are making a statement behind it, intended or not. HH choose a ninja. O.K. Would it make a difference if he choose a rabit? No, because he isn't continuing a already painful truth in society. It's funny to think about cartoon being totally false and not "PC", but when you try and joke about a "oppressed and racist past" that is not acceptable. There clearly is a difference. If instead A&F choose to have a muslim and a goat on the front of the shirt and making some sort of joke on it, do you think that would be an acceptable practice? Do you have the power to not only make statements on shirts like that and sell them all across the most power nation in the world? This is the point I'm trying to make. It's not acceptable because it's INTENDED. They are worsening a situation that shouldn't even exist. You don't see A&F making t-shirts that comment on the hallocaust or on the irish potato famine and the families being forced to moved to Canada. Though you not feel it to be a sensitive topic, as David so kindly pointed out "your not walking in my shoes", I get enough racism here in Toronto and I don't need someone with any real power moving it forwards in the form of a t-shirt influencing a generation of americans into thinking that Chinese americans aren't "white american" and therefore not american by their racist standards.

JawZ · Post by **JawZ** » Sat Apr 20, 2002 3:14 pm

I wonder how many people at A&F had a hand in getting this to market and didn't see that there may be a problem?

Do you know how many people were involved in designing the shirt, marketting the shirt, distributing the shirt, testing the shirt, making the shirt, quality checking the shirt, and not one person noticed that it may become a problem. Why?

Jim · Post by **Jim** » Sat Apr 20, 2002 3:19 pm

Originally posted by UOD
I wonder how many people at A&F had a hand in getting this to market and didn't see that there may be a problem?

Do you know how many people were involved in designing the shirt, marketting the shirt, distributing the shirt, testing the shirt, making the shirt, quality checking the shirt, and not one person noticed that it may become a problem. Why?

I'm sure they noticed, but they probably didn't think people would be offended by it as they were. They figured it would be a great joke to sell more shirts, and instead, it blew up in their face.

This isn't the first time A&F has had problems like this. They had sold shirts and given out their catalogs (targeted at, of course, the middle & high school aged crowds) with things such as "Drinking 101" and recipies for different mixed drinks. MADD got all over that one, and A&F pulled it. Did they try to "harm" anyone in either case? No, but they were probably stepping beyond their normal role of mass producing clothes so all teens can look alike.

Sure, this may have gone through 50+ people before it started being printed, but either (A) nobody objected to it or (B) their objections weren't noted or recieved by the people making this shirt.

torsten · Post by **torsten** » Sat Apr 20, 2002 3:43 pm

I really think they may have noticed it, but just figured, hey, nobody ever complains if you stereotype Asians. Again, the double standard. Europeans and Asians can get verbally kicked around, but most other groups have to be treated like a fragile newborn.

Another theory is that they're deliberately pushing the edge of sensitivities in order to get publicity - knowing that the majority of their buyers are not going to be turned off, but that they'll get lots of exposure that they'd otherwise have to pay for. I think Calvin Klein has done this on occasion.

Deus ex Machina · Post by **Deus ex Machina** » Sat Apr 20, 2002 4:06 pm

Originally posted by torsten
I really think they may have noticed it, but just figured, hey, nobody ever complains if you stereotype Asians. Again, the double standard. Europeans and Asians can get verbally kicked around, but most other groups have to be treated like a fragile newborn.

Another theory is that they're deliberately pushing the edge of sensitivities in order to get publicity - knowing that the majority of their buyers are not going to be turned off, but that they'll get lots of exposure that they'd otherwise have to pay for. I think Calvin Klein has done this on occasion.

The Asians do complain, they are not quite as vocal.

The over-sensitivity you describe might be attributed to the power of the derisions used as well as the history of the targeted group. There is no "standard" per se. Is there a word for Europeans that cut as deeply as Nigg*r? A symbol as detestable as the Swastika for Christians?

shant,
david

SG Broadband Community

OMG! I officially hate Abercrombie and Fitch!!!

My comments on this

What I;m wondering is

Re: What I;m wondering is

Re: What I;m wondering is

Re: OMG! I officially hate Abercrombie and Fitch!!!

Obviously some people missed this